There are criticisms that are antisemitic. This isn't one of them, though.

My favorite was when Bernie Sanders was called antisemitic for criticizing Israel. His response was something along the lines of "It isn't antisemitic to criticize a right-wing government in Israel." It must've taken all the patience in the world to not add "you fucking toolbags".

Fascists get away with conflating Judaism and Zionism because they don't teach that Zionism has absolutely nothing to do with Judaism, and actually goes against a lot of their values. It's actually been around for quite awhile; you know the crusades, when they went around killing a bunch of civilians to set up settlements? Those were Christian Zionists.

That's why it's anti-semitic to conflate the two. One is a religion and the other is a fascist genocidal colonialist movement. So next time you see some german lady shouting down a holocaust survivor for calling out Israeli apartheid (yes, this literally happened, and it was the Jewish guy who got punished) you'll see it for what it is. It's not complicated, it's a clear cut case of modern day nazism.

sounds like something The Other Side would say

You don't live in an open air prison so enjoy it.

and like a football match, people are watching it happen live on youtube

I think it's technically a thousands of years quagmire.

Unfortunately, those that don't fall under what you're describing simply don't comment because they know it's a massive, nuanced issue, so all you're seeing are the loudest, least nuanced voices

deleted by creator

I hope more of you fake nuanced people go back to Reddit.

"bro please bro it's complicated bro you can't oppose apartheid bro have you not considered it's complicated bro? Please bro you have to maintain status quo"

This! Was searching the whole comment section and wanted to post it just now and luckily hit refresh.

I agree with you that it needs to be clarified further. While I think it is still "resistance" in the sense that it was done with the intention to resist occupation and all what Israel does, I do agree that civilians died that didn't need to, and it did not lead to positive results.

When you live your whole life in a concentration camp and get bombed almost daily, you may lose some rationality and start justifying more things in the name or resistance. Ultimately I blame Israel for putting them in this situation, and putting civilians so close to their border.

In the end, my whole point is that Hamas attack must not justify a response from Israel. It should lead us to pull back instead.

I'm sorry, but are you the arbiter of all emotional responses?

Also, are "imaginary blood beliefs" and "resisting massacre" the same to you? Because you act like they are.

This feels more like an excuse to disengage than understand or criticize.

makes me care less

What has your hesitant caring (if even true) achieved before? Is there anything lost that we should worry about?

We actually much rather you take a step back and leave us. Please start by telling your governments to gtfo of Middle east and stop all intervention. We don't want you.

I would not equate the too. Not to mention, Israel sponsored Hamas.

Do you somehow not realise that is exactly the point being made?

Jesus Christ I had to scroll through like, 10 top level comments to find someone with a measure of reason. I'm actually stunned.

If civilians are civilians…

"Amongst Israelis, 69% of those killed were civilians and 31% members of the IDF. The number of Israeli civilians killed, from attacks by Palestinian armed groups or individuals, has declined steadily, peaking in 2002 at an average of 22 deaths per month, and dropping markedly to an average of one civilian per month in 2007. 6/

In contrast to Israeli figures, however, Palestinian civilian fatalities have remained high. Palestinian civilians, killed by Israeli security forces, peaked with an average of 35 deaths per month in 2002, and again in 2004. In 2007 they dropped slightly to an average of ten civilian deaths per month."

https://www.un.org/unispal/document/auto-insert-208380/

Both sides kill civilians with abandon, and Israel is markedly better at it. Major media doesn’t seem to care very much about Palestinian civilians though.

I completely agree with you. Which is why when you look at the grotesque number of civilians Israel kills every year it’s pretty easy to condem them.

Israel kills more civilians.

Now your upvote counter is the twin towers.

EDIT: And if you think about it, my upvote counter is the twin towers shortly after

EDIT2: Too far! Too far!

https://lemy.lol/post/11080592 for the curious.

On Lemmy, you firstly see the message before the messenger. That is something that makes it magical, it clears your self-history and allow you to have a free mind on ideas presented.

"The genocide must stop" is what you consider to be terrorism? Oh yeah, you must be from the west, where terrorism is resisting massacre.

there is no bigger terrorist than Israel.

Hard to notice something when you close your eyes and plug your ears

That’s why you never heard a peep from them about the murders of innocent Palestinians

I even heard that Israel soldiers instead to shoot to kill, they shoot on legs, this way doesn't count as "dead".
Source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/04/gaza-strip-protesters-received-bullet-wounds-to-ankles-medics-report

authoritarian xenophobes

It's OK, this isn't reddit, you can say cracker.

It’s important to note that the real disparity may be even far worse.

OCHA-OPT (the committee gathering this data) is strict about verifying validity of Palestinian casualties, requiring two independent, verified and non-affiliated sources. Casualties in Israel, however, they trust the media at face value. They also exclude a lot of Palestinian casualties even when verified in certain situations. Example, and I quote them:

People who were killed or injured in conflict-related incidents that took place in Israel and did not involve residents of the oPt are also excluded.

oPt (occupied Palestinian territories) are the areas that Israel does not directly oversee. So most of Israel is not oPt by their criteria.

Israel is notorious for restricting journalists reporting on Israeli crimes, and has murdered journalists countless of times, like last year the Christian Palestinian Shireen Abu Akleh reporting on the forced expulsion of Palestinians from Sheikh Jarrah (so not even in a war zone area). This causes many casualties to go unverified and thus undocumented.

And Israel has been caught lying before about its own casualties, like the 40 beheaded babies.

Take that as you will.

That 2023 number is about to get way more lopsided.

While I agree with you about Hamas, the fact you don't apply the same logic to the IDF is very telling. A country that believes a whole group of people are less than human and wants them eradicated absolutely intends every casualty it inflicts.

Israeli snipers murder innocent children, journalists and medical staff because of evil intentions.

Israeli bombs dropped on one of the densest populated areas which are bound to inflict civilian casualties are doing their intended evil.

The choice to turn off the electricity even though it will guarantee deaths in hospitals is not bad luck and is evil.

Israel is evil.

In fact if we're going by civilian casualties Israel is like 36x more evil.

Why can't they be compared? People killed with a knife are just as dead as people killed with a missile.

Hamas wanted to kill as many citizens of Israel as possible

Source?

This is false. Hamas is not free of criticism, they did commit needless killing of civilians, but their main target remains the IDF. This is contrasted with Israel, whose target is civilians.

Even the music festival was located right next to the Re'im base. The festival itself had Israeli gunned men and tanks. Again, I do not condemn the civilians needlessly killed by some Hamas members, but the operation's target was the military.

I have a solution for you: why shouldn't we live with Israelis in peace? Why can't we have a Democratic state for all? Israel loses this "historical land" battle, but even if they didn't, does that justify massacre? Palestinians have always advocated a state for all, but Israel never agrees.