kronisk

Even cnailshells would have to adhere to the basic laws of conchology though

I mean, it could be a manual photoshop job.

It could, but the double spiral in the shell indicates AI to me. Snail shells don’t grow like that. If it was a manual job, someone would have used a picture of a real shell.

I have done plenty of research, thank you. Of course even more research never hurts.

Er, that’s what I am saying however is that you can observe and measure consciousness.

Going with any definition of consciousness relevant to this discussion, say phenomenality and/or awareness, no.

I am not sure why it’s hard to accept that some living things may not be conscious. Viruses propagate “mindlessly”, they’re neither living nor conscious.

That’s not really the point - I don’t claim to know what entities possess consciousness. The point is that you don’t either.

I also don’t understand why you think emergent properties are a hypothesis. Emergent properties of biological processes are fact

Obviously I’m talking about Emergentism as it relates to consciousness, and the idea that consciousness is an emergent property is not a fact, no. And there are perfectly valid reasons - for example, the “explanatory gap” - why someone might find it unsatisfactory.

So, I’m guessing everyone in this thread has a different conception of what “consciousness” actually is and what we’re talking about here, which makes it difficult to discuss casually like this. You seem to have a very exclusive definition of consciousness, which only serves to avoid the argument, really. “It’s possible that same organisms exhibit some parts of consciousness as we have noticed till now, but if those organisms do not exhibit all parts of consciousness then they’re not conscious”…you’re splitting hairs. If plants could be proven to be aware, have subjective experience, a sense of self, it would be reasonable to change our definition of consciousness to be more inclusive - simply because such a concept of consciousness would be a lot more useful then.

Emergentism is a popular hypothesis, not a fact. Christof Koch lost the bet, remember? The idea that “all organisms which are conscious have to exhibit the same properties” and “you cannot pick and choose” does not logically follow from anything you’ve said. These are criteria that you set up yourself. Take the idea of qualia as an example, how could we ever observe that an animal or a plant does or does not experience qualia? Nobody solved the problem of other minds.

Consciousness is nothing like a heart; the function of the heart can be observed and measured. How do you know that you possess awareness? You can only experience it. (Actually, that we are aware is the only thing we can know with complete certainty.)

which we don’t observe in those which lack consciousness.

See what you did there? You assume a priori which entities lack consciousness, and then motivate this by claiming they lack traits that can be observed in conscious entities. That is very neatly circular.

Sure, nothing is more masculine than having a preference for men.

I think the brain is only where the concentration of prions is highest and therefore the most dangerous part of an infected person to eat, but you can also get it from other body parts. But I’m no expert… haven’t eaten anyone in years actually.

What, you don’t enjoy a bunch of sleepy whiny junkies self-indulgently wailing through a three chord Bob Dylan cover for 15 minutes? Man, weren’t nineties arena rock great.

It was more in response to your comments. I don’t think anyone has a problem with useful FOSS alternatives per se.

So, lick the boot instead of resisting you say?

Edit: actually, read zerakith’s comment instead.

He is obviously inflated, she has to hold him down or else he’ll float to the ceiling.

Well, I for one want to hear more about your racist dog?

How about punk rock is the only thing that is punk rock, starting now?

“It’s a lovely morning in the village, and you are a horrible goose.”

Wearing band logos are very different to wearing brand logos. A band logo stands for something that you love, a brand is just capitalist nihilism; completely meaningless except signaling how much your garment costs and perhaps that you are stupid enough to believe that buying a certain brand says something about you or aligns you with something. Branding is for cattle.

Her blown up remains you mean?

I use it to make my phone less appealing and thus waste less time on it.

Yes, that’s what I use mine for as well. I have the apps I need to access daily as shortcuts and all other apps stuffed away from sight.

Thanks, I’ll check Blank out as well.

I used to work with an Apple fanboy that knew next to nothing about how computers actually work, but he knew that Apple was the best at everything. Any time someone brought up something about a device or service from any other company or with any other OS, his stock answer was always “switch to Apple”. Any time someone pointed out that their device offered a feature or functionality they appreciated that Apple did not offer in a convenient way, his stock answer was always “You don’t need that.” Sometimes he’d add “why would you want to do that? Do X instead”.

Fast forward to today, I ended up killing him and am writing this from jail.