France is to enshrine in law the end of so-called “conjugal rights” – the notion that marriage means a duty to have sex.
A bill approved on Wednesday in the National Assembly adds a clause to the country’s civil code to make clear that “community of living” does not create an “obligation for sexual relations”.
The proposed law also makes it impossible to use lack of sexual relations as an argument in fault-based divorce.
Though unlikely to have a major impact in the courts, supporters hope the law will help deter marital rape.
There are several concepts you may wish to read up on, such as polyamory and divorce.
Except that is exactly what this law states - that you can onesidedly divorce based on a sexless marriage. So now you cant divorce for fault and need your spouses approval
That… is not how any of this works. You can totally divorce even if your spouse refuses. There’s mutual consent, at fault, mutual acceptance of marital breakdown (irreconcilable differences), and definitive severance- i.e, you are no longer living as a couple.
As a side note, it’s fucking hilarious that your worst possible imaginary scenario is what’s been actual reality for most women until extremely recently.
Am I just misunderstanding what your saying, to me the worst case scenario for women would be what the right in American wants, for men to have to give approval for a divorce.
That’s absolutely not what I want, I’m just saying sexalual drive varies greatly and if you are someone who loves sex and suddenly you find yourself in a dead bedroom,. You should have the right to leave the relationship and make yourself happy
I think you are misunderstanding this thread.
The person I’m replying to thinks the law change means you are potentially trapped in a marriage you no longer want and need your spouses ‘approval’ to leave (in the case of a sexually dead marriage) - which isn’t just US right wing fantasy, it’s been a reality for women worldwide and still is in many places.
They are incorrect btw. You have the right to leave a dead bedroom marriage. You have the right to find a more sexually compatible partner. The law changes we’re discussing do not remove any of these from people under french law.
Can you pls not misgender me thank you
Apologies, removed the (men)
I mean I am not from France but as far as I can see there is not an option in this list from that is not a fault and not strictly a way to do a divorce on your own. https://refugies.info/en/procedure/60a7b164331be50014dd88cc
How does this work then can you guide me to information about it?
The only option here would be to not live together which maybe impossible for you financially or could even be boycotted by your partner and it would take a year at least as far as I can see here. So therefore their needs to be a different way you didn’t had on your list or on the refugirs info side that’s an option for a faultless one sided divorce because you are in a sexless marriage
Well i listed a series of literal legal divorce categories in france, just in english names.
the at fault one is the only one affected by this change, and you can still have other reasons why you think the other person tanked the marriage ( a “fault” divorce is basically “I can’t stay married to this person, they broke it” which is why they’re saying "no, you can’t say “refused to give me the sex i want” - It’s a pressure tactic that can get in the bin)
Like all laws you can get dispensations and other proofs - like you said in this economy you might me stuck together but if you have separate personal bills and can prove you’ve been out dating other people, living in a different room and having a separate life it would probably fly. Also again, it’s just the sex that’s no longer a reason, for you to get to the point where you have a dead bed marriage and are unable to talk out a reasonable arrangement or divorce there are going to be a lot of other reasons you can cite for an at fault divorce.
But realistically, most people work it out. An at fault is usually a punishment move. Sometimes the punishment is deserved , sometimes it’s just spite. This law aims to remove sexual coercion.
Ok but where is that other possibility you are talking about? There are like you said and stated 4 different ways:
Both agree and agree on the splitting of possessions
Both agree and disagree on the splitting of possessions
Your spouse commits “serious or renewed violation of the duties and obligations”
And you don’t live together anymore for at least a year and this is not consensually (which it seems you would also have to prove)
Given you live in a dead bedroom relationship (say after you got children or due to medical problems) and you accepted it (which can take years already). From these 4 choices you are basically out of luck and stuck. Either you get a new place (and potentially abandon your children) or you can proof that you life together but in rapture(I think that’s the correct word) but this can very easily be impeded by your spouse and if you are the primary caregiver for your children even hard to proof. I mean you can get your own bank but when your partner just doesn’t give you money you kinda still have to use the shared one or get bills paid by your partner. Do I miss anything here? Because this means instead of however long a divorce will take it will now take at least a year more. Because if I see this correctly with the acceptance period and cout time this will already take upwards of 4 years or 5% of your life were your needs will not be satisfied(or even attempted to be satisfied).
I don’t know about France but most civilized countries I know about have laws against rape in marriage, without looking it up I guess France have too. Martial obligations should encompass normal relationship things like caring for each other, being consensual and having sex. Saying key points for a median relationship like sex are not part of your obligation in a marriage feels absurd to me. Feeling coerced to have sex to not fault the marriage for me feels again completely illogical even as an argument. At this point your marriage is broken because at least one partner is very unhappy with it. This will just prolong the time you are stuck in a broken marriage and therefor maximize unhappiness. Having a dead bedroom marriage can even lead to you being unfaithful, faulting your marriage. Sex is the strongest urge in humans after all. This all just seems like a lot of Christian morals and not much of useful laws.
Btw if sex is not a martial obligation why is faithfulness again? Does sex now matter for marriage or does it not?
For me this feels just like populism. instead of useful and meaningful changes to an obviously broken law a bandaid is used that just makes the law more broken. It is based on “things have occured” without any data to back it up just on a “feels like it level”. Why, instead, scrap option 3 and 4 and just replace it with a “doesn’t work for me anymore” option? Why is there still a judgement based system and not a relationship quality based system in place? Because this is just veiled populism, sexism and religious moral.